potc naval questions [the Dalaverse]

You're viewing

the_dala's journal
Create a Dreamwidth Account Learn More

Reload page in style: site light

←

→

Going to post a version of this to kiss_me_hardy as well, I think. I wish I had the Hornblower books handy, but they're Daddy's and they're at home.

1. How exactly does one get to be a midshipman? Does it have anything to do with money or blood or favors?
2. It seems to be fanon that Gillette is Norrington's first lieutenant and Groves his second. But is there any actual proof of this?
3. I'm assuming somebody would get court-martialed for the incident with the Interceptor. Norrington, Gillette, or both (and/or the captain of the ship, if Norrington doesn't count as such)? Would they have to go back to England for the trial? What's the lightest penalty I could get away with (I'm hoping for a demotion at the very most for Gillette, and a virtual slap on the wrist for Norrington)?

Mood::

creative

←

→

There are 19 comments on this entry. (Reply.)

1) You get to be a midshipman either by having a Captain agree to take you on as one-- which means it's a matter of knowing somebody, or knowing somebody who knows somebody-- or by going to the Naval Academy and training for a few years. I'm not sure when that was set up, but one of Jane Austen's brothers (Frank, who ended up an Admiral) did that.

2) As far as I know, there's no evidence for that at all. In my and

commodorified's MMW uni, we arbitrarily declared that Groves was the officer in command of the Interceptor at the time, based purely on the fact that he was consulting with Norrington on the dock.

3) I had a discussion on the whole Interceptor thing in my LJ not too long ago. You might want to read it. But the short form is: whoever was the official Commanding Officer of the Interceptor would be the one court-martialled. It would probably happen in either Kingston (which is literally across the bay) or Port Royal. The penalty could range anywhere from a reprimand (if the captain wasn't even physically there at the time, say) to being dismissed the service in disgrace, depending on the circumstances.

Aha, that was you! I knew I'd seen something about that issue recently ::scurries off to read up:: Thankee.

So, re: the first question, it wouldn't be inconceivable for the three mids to be from very different financial backgrounds, as long they either studied or had some friendly uncles. I'll have to look up the Academy and seen how early a boy might start -- I'm thinking it would be Gillette who attended, and he would only be sixteen at the time of the fic.

[link] [parent] [reply]

I have a vague memory of

mimesere including in one of her pic-spam commentaries that the pennant flying on the Interceptor was the fleet commander's -- that is, Norrington's -- or something of the sort, making that his flag-ship. iirc she used it to point out that our man has a need for speed. ;)

But don't rely on my memory...

[link] [parent] [reply]

That was in

gryphons_lair's comments, too. A good case could be made for either one being Norrington's flagship. Dammit, why can't he have them both?!

Ah well, I'll make a decision when I get to that point. Thanks for the help :)

[link] [parent] [reply]

Yes, but see the discussion I cite above for why that was probably a temporary thing.

[link] [parent] [reply]

Oooh, that discussion looks fabulous! Have Memoried to look through later. How'd I miss seeing that?

[link] [parent] [reply]

I believe you were Writing Original Fic at the time. :)

[link] [parent] [reply]

2. Since Norrington gives most of his orders directly to Gillette it would be pretty safe to assume he's 1st Lt. There's less proof about Groves but he's obviously around the same rank as Gillette so I think 2nd Lt is a fairly safe assumption

Ah, but I want to switch them, see :) Or really, Gillette's not going to be Norrington's lieutenant at all. I don't think. Perhaps his captain's ill for the duration of the movie.

[link] [parent] [reply]

Um, if the Dauntless is Norrington's ship (likely, see my link) and Gillette was in charge when Jack & Will boarded, he's almost certainly one of Norrington's lieutenants.

Groves, OTOH, might very well not be.

[link] [parent] [reply]

Crap ::sighs:: I keep forgetting they took the Dauntless to begin with. That doesn't gel with the storyline...but in any case, I'm still ten to twelve years ahead of myself here.

[link] [parent] [reply]

Norrington calls Gillette by title of Lieutenant. Groves is listed in the credits as an officer, but neither name nor rank are ever actually mentioned. Like

gryphons_lair said, Gillette, a lieutenant and in (temporary) command, would almost certainly (though not necessarily, but there's no-one Norrington turns to above him, really) be a 1st. Lt. Also, in the extras, I believe it is Verbinski who says the Dauntless is the flagship here, which makes sense because she's a bloody three-decker! Though him captaining the Interceptor for a stint is understandable (and apparent, according to the colors she's flying).

I remember justifying the 100-gun-ship-out-in-the-Carib-with-only-one-pirate-threat-left thing to myself in a fic once... it's always rankled me *scowl* But now I've forgotten what I said to convince myself.

Don't really have anything to cite for 1. but iirc going through the Naval Acadamy was looked down on somewhat. Kind of the whole textbook sailor vs real sailor. Seeing as midshipman could be as young as 11 (as Nelson was) it was thought that better naval officers were created by going directly aboard than to the Acadamy, at least they often ended up with more practical experience.

/my vaguely recalled 2 cents.

That works, though -- another factor to work into Gillette's neuroses. Does it date back as far as I need it too -- say late 1600s?

[link] [parent] [reply]

Um, not certain. I'm thinking it wasn't really est. at that time and a quick hunt seems to back it up.

http://www.mykreeve.net/london/greenwich/royal_naval_college/

Except I'm thinking there was somewhere else, because I know there was some sort of naval college thingy in the mid to late 1700s...

Let me go do a bit more looking (plus I have the dad looking, too :-D)

[link] [parent] [reply]

I LOVE TEH MONKEY ::smooches:: I was just braining Google with fruitless searches. Don't worry, I don't need it ~~for the smut~~ right this minute :)

[link] [parent] [reply]

*g* That'll give me sometime to perhaps hunt down where I read all this stuff.

I actually think that the late 1600s predates any formal school, and what the dad found seems to show that as well. It was all pretty much get yourself on a ship.

But, here (http://www.port.nmm.ac.uk/) is a great place to start looking for intel. Also check out the JMR article archive (http://www.jmr.nmm.ac.uk/server/show/nav.009000001).

One little tidbit that I do remember (and has been a constant thorn with regards to when I personally set the movie) is that the Royal Navy didn't have an institution-wide uniform till around 1740. Officers pretty much wore whatever a gentleman would wear. And seeing as I generally set it around 1720... :-D

[link] [parent] [reply]

THANKEE!

Okay, so Gillette totally had an admiral uncle, but then he totally died not long after setting him on a ship. PROBLEM SOLVED. And that's not even IN the sex which I AM WRITING AT THIS VERY MOMENT OMG.

Groves: Finally! A young midshipman can only take so much.

[link] [parent] [reply]

~~for the smut~~

~~omg yay!~~

[link] [parent] [reply]

January